GWSIG Monthly Meeting Minutes/Meeting30

International Game Developers Association

wendy despain: I'm not really here yet. I'm just foolin' ya.
Beth A. Dillon: Same here
Corvus: 'allo
Corvus: I, on the other hand, am really here
Corvus: and I'm armed with a sick poodle
Corvus: So everyone had better watch their step
Steve Jacobs: Greetings all
Corvus: Hello, Steve
Tim L: Hi all
Corvus: *sevaw
Steve Jacobs: Ok, room all set
Steve Jacobs: BRB
Kim Sparks: Hi all. I can only stay for a few minutes. I'm working on-site and ducked out of a meeting.
Ron Toland: hello
Kim Sparks: Hi, Ron
Steve Jacobs: back
Steve Jacobs: Wendy, you here yet???
Amman: Hello everyone. My name is Amman and first time here. Calling from the UK and a writer in short film and theatre. Trying to break into video game writing.
Corvus: Hello, Amman
Tim L: Hi Amman .. I'm Tim and British, too, though based in LA
Kim Sparks: Hi, Amman
Ron Toland: hey, amman
Beth A. Dillon: Wendy's here but out of this window until everyone is here me thinks.
Amman: Very excited to be here. Attended a Game Writing programme back in Jan 07 with Bafta by James Swallow - co wrote the IGDA Writing Games Narrative.
Steve Jacobs: All the folks for the main agenda items are, so we should get going
Steve Jacobs: I'm happy to bang the gavel
wendy despain: I'm here now
Steve Jacobs: Tim, you're up
Tim L: OK ... I guess the idea is to discuss practical ways the SIG can work with the WGA ... perhaps with me as the intermediary?
wendy despain: what's your vision for the setup, Tim?
wendy despain: you can pretty much make it what you want it to be :-)
Tim L: Open to suggestions ... but perhaps a sub-committee which i might chair/co-chair which has at its focus liaison with other professional bodies, of which the WGA would be the key one?
Steve Jacobs: makes sense
Tim L: i'd also like to run to be on the SIG committee, too, but I presume that would be something in the future some time.
Tim L: My vision for the committee would be to detemrine common-ground areas of interest and concern, and where there are differences of opinion/etc, and what the committee would recommend be done about them
wendy despain: just keep showing up to these meetings and volunteering for things and you'll get coopted onto the committee
Beth A. Dillon: Instead of being a sub-committee it would be an initiative, yes?
Steve Jacobs: Makes sense Beth
Tim L: whatever the best term would be
wendy despain: we haven't had much success with sub-committees yet. :-) but there's always a first time for everything
Beth A. Dillon: I'm all for either way but it sounds like a Liaison initiative
wendy despain: the SIG definitely wants to work well with other organizations out there
Tim L: sounds fine to me
Beth A. Dillon: Then we can highlight it on the wiki initiatives page, ha ha.
Tim L: the initiative might want to scope out other prof entities such as SAG and AFTRA etc to look into common interests ...
Ron Toland: what's the difference between an initiative and a sub-committee?
Tim L: there's a wiki initiatives page? lol
Corvus: The Initiative has bunkers under Sunnydale
Beth A. Dillon: We don't have sub-committees at the moment.
wendy despain: we tried sub-committees in the past and had a hard time scouring up enough people
wendy despain: it always ends up being the same core group of volunteers, heh
wendy despain: so calling it a subcommittee seemed a little redundant and weird
Beth A. Dillon: http://www.igda.org/wiki/Game_Writers_SIG/Initiatives
wendy despain: thanks Beth
Amman: Does anyone know if there are reciprocal agreements between WGA and WGGB? There is a standard for rates for those writing video games in the UK. Although not enforced it empowers writers with what the minimums are. Great guidebook written by James Swallow and the Guild: </b>http://www.writersguild.org.uk/public/userimages/File/Guidelines/1490_WG_gamesbklt_lr.pdf
wendy despain: Andy Walsh, who is also on the exec board of the SIG is our official Liaison with the WGGB
Tim L: no, no formal reciprocal agreement that i am aware of between WGAw and WGGB
wendy despain: there's nothing official in writing, but we have a good working relationship with them
Beth A. Dillon: So we can volunteer Andy for this, heehee.
wendy despain: Andy couldn't make it to this meeting, but we could sure volunteer him :-)
Tim L: i know in the WGA we would be hesitant to print rates like that guide does for the UK. Some of our writers have got over $200,000 for a game and would not like the US industry to be told it should have been 450 pnds a day!
Beth A. Dillon: Yeah I'm sure.
Amman: That is serious money.
Tim L: One area the initiative might work on immediately is that of writing credits. the IGDA is making proposals right now that are similar to but different from the ideas within the WGA and it would be great to have synergy
Beth A. Dillon: Good thinking
Steve Jacobs: do we have a consencus here? Do we need to vote or can Tim just move forward? Time we do have a credits intiative that you could link to
Tim L: it would be good to link to the credits initiative, yes, and provide feedback as to what WGA members think about IGDA proposals for credits.
wendy despain: Stephen Dinehart is our official credits committee liaison, though I think he's in crunch mode at the moment
Tim L: and vice versa of course
Beth A. Dillon: And help him find volunteers, cough.
wendy despain: but John Feil is also on the credits committee
Tim L: i'd like to help him, and be happy to do so. I know John well so that would be good if I could help them out
Kim Sparks: I have to get back to my meeting. Sorry about that. I've asked Steve to report on Write Club at Future Play. I'll read the rest of the meeting notes later tonight. Bye.
wendy despain: i think right now the credits committee would love any feedback they can get. they've been begging for it for months.
wendy despain: they've got a forum set up on www.igda.org
Tim L: i didnt know that, i would have given them feedback. glad i am more in the loop at last now
wendy despain: check out the igda wiki, Tim. I think you'll find a lot of interesting stuff there
Tim L: will do
wendy despain: :-)
wendy despain: well, if there are things you think of that the SIG can do to work better with the WGA, let us know
Tim L: will do, and similarly if people can feed me thoughts on what could be discussed between the SIG and the WGA then that would be great
Tim L: from the recent List exchanges a lot of what needed to be done was exploding myths, but there is more work needed for sure
wendy despain: sort of merging this agenda item and the next one - does the WGA have any officialish sessions set up for GDC?
Tim L: sore point ... suffice to say the person we presumed was setting up the WGA GDC session dropped the ball and missed deadlines...I now have the job of seeing if we can get a WGA session somehow, some way
Steve Jacobs: What do we know about other efforts? Announcements go out Monday, right?
Tim L: or getting WGA representation (i.e. me) on a panel ...
wendy despain: i know we've got our usual SIG "group gathering" on the schedule
wendy despain: I'll be running that
Tim L: i know i am on a education sig panel (aged game people in education .. or game veterans, some such term lol)
Beth A. Dillon: Haven't heard back about Write Club
wendy despain: heh
Beth A. Dillon: Apparently Sande also submitted it though
wendy despain: you know, Tim, considering some of the questions you got on the mailing list, it might do the WGA some good to take a lower profile at GDC this year
Steve Jacobs: Got an education panel to put together as well, so will plug the sig there
Tim L: or have a different profile .. more the kind i would bring to a panel than the kind the guild reps tend to bring :)
wendy despain: if Write Club doesn't get approved, is there any interest in running it as a "pub game" type thing at... perhaps... the IGDA party?
Steve Jacobs: yah, could work
wendy despain: i'm just brainstorming really
Tim L: yeah
Tim L: you had me at pub and game
wendy despain: heh
Beth A. Dillon: Heehee
Steve Jacobs: We might wanna think of another thing as well, we've considered straight writing awards, dramatized scripts, clip shows from games best writing moments of the year, etc
wendy despain: who knows they'll be going to GDC for sure?
Tim L: me
Steve Jacobs: moi aussi
Ron Toland: me
Amman: not me unfortunately.
Corvus: me
wendy despain: if we used this meeting as a random sampling, 95% of game writers will be there. heh.
Tim L: Amman have you ever been to GDC? It would be worth your while trying to make it there
Steve Jacobs: might want to do a special meeting and/or focus next meeting specifically on GDC and invite folks who know they'll be going
Beth A. Dillon: Heh heh
wendy despain: i don't think we can be that lucky, but I can talk to Jason about taking over part of the IGDA party
Tim L: writers corner in the party?
Beth A. Dillon: We'd need sitting space--not something very common at the IGDA parties
Tim L: featuring open bottles of whiskey
wendy despain: if we can leach off that party we won't have to do as much heavy lifting
Beth A. Dillon: True
Corvus: get enough tipsy writers in one area and people will probably vacate. Then we can have all the seats we need. ;)
Tim L: a cordoned off area in one corner might work
Steve Jacobs: Other option I listed shift us from needing tables to being front rom entertainment
wendy despain: we can take some of the ideas and discussion on this to the committee mailing list or the main mailing list. we don't have to conduct all our business here :-)
Steve Jacobs: options
wendy despain: since half our time is gone, I vote we move on to the next agenda item
Tim L: agreed
Beth A. Dillon: Indeedy
wendy despain: so Beth, how goes the quarterly for GDC?
Beth A. Dillon: Okay so I'll be quick
Beth A. Dillon: Got two interviews out of five, cough, but expecting more in shortly. Waiting on Orkin's article. Have Evan's chapter.
Beth A. Dillon: I'll solicit the list for any "ads" they want in there.
Steve Jacobs: Beth you oughta work on that cold :-)
Beth A. Dillon: It should be ready at the end of December for printing.
wendy despain: email Bioware to see if they want to sponsor it
Beth A. Dillon: Heehee I know, I live in an attic and it's cold.
Beth A. Dillon: Oh yes BioWare.
Beth A. Dillon: Will do.
Steve Jacobs: Maybe UBI or redstorm
wendy despain: they could be the official sponsor for about $1500 - that's usually the rough printing costs
Beth A. Dillon: Soo last deal of business is distribution. Not sure I'll be at GDC, so we'll need someone to handle that. J is still doing layout for us.
Beth A. Dillon: k
wendy despain: It looks like I'm not going to be able to avoid going to GDC this year
Beth A. Dillon: Yeah?
wendy despain: so you could send it to my hotel and I could get it to the IGDA booth
Beth A. Dillon: Okay
wendy despain: then people with writing-related sessions could pick up copies there
Beth A. Dillon: And that concludes the Quarterly report!
Steve Jacobs: Should be able to drop ship straight to igda booth
Steve Jacobs: work with Jason to get the shipping info
wendy despain: oh, good point Steve
Beth A. Dillon: Making note
wendy despain: this is why we love Steve
Steve Jacobs: saves Wendy or me from dragging it to the con center
Beth A. Dillon: Yeah
wendy despain: one year we had some volunteers willing to stand outside writing related sessions and push copies into people's hands
wendy despain: that would be awesome
Corvus: I'm volunteered to be a CA again this year
Steve Jacobs: Should coordinate that again
Beth A. Dillon: Especially with that much money spent on printing
wendy despain: but we can tackle that job when we get closer to the time
Corvus: I'll happily liason with Tim and Ian if you need to
Steve Jacobs: I think a GDC operation and logistics focus would be valuable fore the next meeting
Beth A. Dillon: Yeah
wendy despain: I'm sure GDC will consume our meetings for the next two months :-)
Steve Jacobs: Maybe do some early work on thew wikki to prep for it
wendy despain: go for it Steve!
wendy despain: this sort of brings me to the next agenda item
Steve Jacobs: Might be able to distribute at RIT booth as well
wendy despain: I. am. swamped.
Beth A. Dillon: Nice transition
Steve Jacobs: Need to get work with out publishing partners to distribute too
wendy despain: one of the most successful things we ever did was a monthly update to the mailing list about all our initiatives
wendy despain: it's a really easy job for someone who wants to get more involved with the SIG
wendy despain: I've been struggling to get it done, but since the last time it came out was like.. July... I'm obviously not doing a great job of it
Beth A. Dillon: Heehee
Steve Jacobs: We'll have to cut your pay :-)
Tim L: sure, whats involved with that and how can i help? (heh kept going just to wendy, didnt mean that)
wendy despain: if anyone wants to take it over for me (Tim?) email me privately and I'll point you in the right direction
Tim L: i'll talk to you off-line about that ... if its something i think i can take on i'd be happy to do so
Amman: I would certainly like to help out where possible.
Amman: even though I'm very new to this.
wendy despain: Tim, your plate is pretty full already. Maybe you should fight it out with Amman. :-)
Tim L: actually i can handle it i think, but maybe i could call on Amman for assitance from time to time? (will email you off line Wendy)
Tim L: did this freeze on me?....
Steve Jacobs: no
Tim L: k, all just went quiet i see
Steve Jacobs: SCorvus??
Corvus: ready for me?
Steve Jacobs: yah
wendy despain: I'm pondering. :-)
Corvus: I have volunteered to help with updating the site
wendy despain: yay for Corvus!
Steve Jacobs: whooppee
wendy despain: he now has the ability to make updates to our webpage
wendy despain: so if there's anything you need or want added there, feel free to contact him directly
Corvus: Wendy is going to forward any existing requests to me so we can get caught up
Beth A. Dillon: Oooo
Corvus: But future requests can come to me directly at corvus.elrod@pjsattic.com
Corvus: I'll also field requests to the list
wendy despain: that's another thing that hasn't been updated for months and months
Corvus: I'll be talking with Wendy about updating Wordpress (for security) and perhaps adding some usefil plugins
Corvus: Or useful plugins even
Steve Jacobs: excellent
Beth A. Dillon: Nice
wendy despain: so hopefully Corvus will give that the fresh life it needs
Tim L: better still
Corvus: Like a contact form, and other delightful toys
wendy despain: the problem is, don't get too attached to Wordpress, Corvus. IGDA's going to be changing things up with the web resources in the not too distant future
Corvus: no worries
wendy despain: at least, that's the word on the street
Corvus: There's always a solution right around the corner
wendy despain: whatever happens I'll make sure you still have editing access
Corvus: groov'
wendy despain: feel free to encourage people to submit new blog entries etc.
Corvus: That's all I've got, I believe
Corvus: Will do
wendy despain: ok, let's get on to your usual updates
Tim L: excelent thanks
wendy despain: I'm focusing on the Techniques book right now
wendy despain: but that doesn't mean the people working on chapters for the Genre book are off the hook
Beth A. Dillon: Heehee
wendy despain: it just means my baleful eye is turned elsewhere right now
Steve Jacobs: I've got a good occulist you can use for that :-)
Amman: sorry - it thew me out. Just logged back in
wendy despain: we're going to be cutting it incredibly close. missed deadlines have brought everything right down to the wire, but we may still be able to get the Technique book out for GDC
wendy despain: that's our goal
wendy despain: and our goal for the Genre book is to get it out in time for professors to get it on their booklists for the fall semester
Beth A. Dillon: Yay Editor Wendy!
Tim L: and the austin GDC
wendy despain: yes
Beth A. Dillon: Yeah
Steve Jacobs: My class is using our first book. 21 students this quarter :-)
wendy despain: rock on Steve!
Beth A. Dillon: I gots ta dash! I'll be back online later.
wendy despain: bye beth
Beth A. Dillon: Bye for now
Tim L: bye
wendy despain: I don't see Stephen Dinehart here right now either, so we'll have to skip the credits committee report
wendy despain: dean wall couldn't make it, so we'll hear more about the contest at another time too, though I know he was feeling like he didn't get much response when he asked for suggestions of writing contests to model ours on
wendy despain: so if you know of a writing contest you love, drop him an email or post it to the general discussion list
wendy despain: he and I agree there's no point reinventing the wheel if we don't have to
Steve Jacobs: Actually got contacted by Austin today about a student game writing analysis review contest/poster session they want to start. More updates as they happen
Tim L: interesting ...
wendy despain: i'm having trouble parsing that, heh
wendy despain: student game writing analysis review contest/poster session
Steve Jacobs: You don't speak Parsel Toungue???
wendy despain: that's why I keep you around Steve, :-)
wendy despain: glad to know Austin is under way for '08 again
wendy despain: looking forward to that as always
Steve Jacobs: Ok, no Sande
Steve Jacobs: I'm stepping in for Kim
wendy despain: or Kim, but she said you knew about Write Club?
Steve Jacobs: Write Club went well at future play
Steve Jacobs: 13-15 participants
Steve Jacobs: Mostly students
Steve Jacobs: could have been a better turnout, but FP screwed up the listing
Steve Jacobs: put in our SIG info instead of the description of twrite club for the "what's happening in this session" info
Steve Jacobs: Still the folks who made it had fun
wendy despain: yikes
Steve Jacobs: Yah, not ideal
Steve Jacobs: Winner took away a copy of the book and a copy of inspiration software donateed by Kim's familly, as per usual
Steve Jacobs: that's it for write club
wendy despain: well, i'm glad you're keeping the tradition alive at FuturePlay
wendy despain: so many conferences, so little time
Steve Jacobs: too true
wendy despain: Dansky skipped the meeting too, so no Whitepaper update
Steve Jacobs: Back to me
wendy despain: i'm sure he'll say he's still working on it, heh
wendy despain: go for it
Steve Jacobs: Ed sig agrees on shared efforts for script and design doc archive
wendy despain: yay
Steve Jacobs: Is happy to have us host it under writers sig
Steve Jacobs: and just link off their page to it
wendy despain: yay
Steve Jacobs: We pick the url, etc
wendy despain: guess what Corvus, we have a new toy for you to play with ;-)
Tim L: That's nice
Corvus: awesome
Steve Jacobs: We just need to put out the word that we're looking for content
Corvus: I <3 new toys
wendy despain: I've had a few people contact me already
Steve Jacobs: Wendy, what do you have for the book already???
wendy despain: I have a lot of "I think I can get permission for this..."
Steve Jacobs: Cool
wendy despain: I'd rather not talk about it :-)
Steve Jacobs: There was that space game script last year I use with my students, blanking on the name...
Amman: Sorry guys, I have to go. Many apologies.
wendy despain: I think if we make it look professional and clean we'll get a good supply of scripts
Tim L: np, glad you could come
wendy despain: hey Amman, drop me an email
Amman: I look forward to speaking to you guys over email.
Steve Jacobs: DOn't need a Ton
wendy despain: I'll put you to work :-)
Amman: Will do, Wendy.
wendy despain: I think the more scripts we can get, the better, but yes I don't think we need to wait for a ton before we unveil and promote it
wendy despain: I think we can officially end the meeting at 8 minutes past (once we pick a date and time for our next meeting)
wendy despain: and anyone who wants to stay after and brainstorm URLs, for a script library, please do
Steve Jacobs: Homeworld!!!! that script :-)
Evan Skolnick: lurking here, didn't want to interrupt your flow. hi, all :-)
wendy despain: hiya Evan
wendy despain: I'm guessing we don't want our next meeting the week of Christmas
Steve Jacobs: yah
Steve Jacobs: Should have one in Dec as January makes GDC six weeks away
Steve Jacobs: 20th?
Steve Jacobs: 13th?
wendy despain: what do people think of Dec 13?
Steve Jacobs: either works for me
wendy despain: I'd prefer the 13th personally
Tim L: not 20th pls i am traveling that day
wendy despain: yeah, I think we'll have that problem with the 20th
wendy despain: let's go with the 13, even though it's only two weeks away
Steve Jacobs: ok, sounds like 13th
Corvus: 13th is good for me
wendy despain: ok, the 13th it is - usual time
wendy despain: thanks for coming everybody!
Corvus: Thanks, Wendy
Tim L: yes thanks wendy
Tim L: and Steve
Corvus: indeed, and Steve
Steve Jacobs: a pleasure as always
wendy despain: ok, so shall we register a new domain name for the script library or hang it off SIG page?
Steve Jacobs: I'm fine with with either
Steve Jacobs: Mostly its about getting it into your book deadline that's the time crunch
wendy despain: yes
Evan Skolnick: *blushes guiltily*
wendy despain: i see risks and benefits to both approaches
Steve Jacobs: Sad news about the transcript, got most but not all. Back to tech support. Most of what we missed was the WGA discussion
Steve Jacobs: Sending you what I got now
wendy despain: gah. thanks Steve.
Tim L: i copied all the first part Steve -- can email it to you
Steve Jacobs: Thanks tim, just sent mine to Wendy
Steve Jacobs: perhaps you should send it to her to merge
Tim L: good idea
wendy despain: did you get the GDC part of the discussion?
wendy despain: yeah, thanks Tim
Steve Jacobs: yah
Tim L: i think i did ... i'll send you all I got (first part and last part ... missed some in the middle)
wendy despain: I worry that a unique URL will make the affiliation with IGDA (and our legitimacy) hazy
Tim L: yeah, unless it was something like IGDAScriptLibrary.com or something ungainly like that
wendy despain: www.igda.org/scriptlibrary would be nice
Tim L: which in theory ought to be entirely possib;e
wendy despain: www.igda.org/writing/scriptlibrary would be easiest
Tim L: that too
wendy despain: scriptlibrary.igda.org would even be theoretically possible
Tim L: yes ... all 3 should work
Steve Jacobs: like sticking writing in to get the sig name in the url
wendy despain: well, I could set up www.igda.org/writing/scriptlibrary today if I find half a second
Corvus: okay, I'm going to bail
Corvus: miles to go and all that
Steve Jacobs: Easiest is best
Tim L: that does get writing and the SIG into the url which i like
Steve Jacobs: THen work with Corvus to post content
wendy despain: I'll check with Jason also to see if he knows if that will work longterm
Steve Jacobs: Nice thing about this is that it doesn't need to be a huge hinking DB
wendy despain: simple is good
Steve Jacobs: A handful of example scripts and docks is all we really need
Steve Jacobs: could be a single page list with direct links to download the stuff and we're done
wendy despain: yes
wendy despain: though imho more is better :-)
Evan Skolnick: heading out too... talk to you later, Wendy. :-)
Steve Jacobs: Always
wendy despain: later Evan
Evan Skolnick: bye all
Steve Jacobs: but figure we start small and if traffic merits it we devote time and resources to go the searchable DB route
Steve Jacobs: later
Steve Jacobs: Evan
Steve Jacobs: not DB route later, though it works
Tim L: need to go - thanks all!
Steve Jacobs: later